ZITAT(Karl mags @ 6. Apr 2018, 20:26)
ZITAT(Stefan Kotsch @ 7. Apr 2018, 19:21)
ZITAT(Karl mags @ 6. Apr 2018, 16:51)
Als Entwickler sollte er auch wissen, dass es einen Mafiaanschlag in den 90ern mit dem Gift gegeben hat ...
Ah. Das ist mir neu. Kannst Du dazu etwas genaueres ausführen? Datenquelle etc.
Tödliche Tropfen im Telefonhörer - sponEs starben der Banker und seine Sekretärin, angeblich auch der Gerichtsmediziner, der die Obduktion vornahm (andere Quelle).
Komme jetzt erst dazu. Die Quellenlage bezüglich des Einsatzes eines militärischen Nervenkampfstoffes vor jHren ist nun doch sehr dürftig. Aus dem bezogenen SPON-Beitrag liest man nur widersprüchliches. Wenn man die gleiche kritische Betrachung anwendet wie bei der Bewertung der Quellen die Russland in den Anschlag verwickelt sehen, dann ist der Mafiaanschlag in den 90ern las nicht belegbar beiseite zu legen. Es kann also nicht als hinreichend belegt angesehen werden, dass der Mafiaanschlag in den 90ern definitiv mit Novichok durchgeführt wurde.
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Die The Times hat diesen Meinungsbeitrag veröffentlicht. Habs bei Facebook gefunden:
The Times : Useful idiots are letting putin off the hookFacebook Corbynistas and others in the West who raise doubts about the Salisbury poisoning are not living in the real world.
If it wasn’t so bloody serious, you’d have to laugh at the irony of it. Back in August 2004, the then MP for Henley joined a small group of parliamentarians calling for the prime minister, Tony Blair, to be impeached. The reason, wrote Boris Johnson, was the “dishonest means of persuasion” Mr Blair had supposedly deployed in the period before the invasion of Iraq.
Nearly 14 years on, it is Mr Johnson accused of being a liar. Two weeks ago (the charge reads) he told a German interviewer that a Porton Down scientist had assured him categorically that the Russian government was responsible for the Skripal attack. But the chief executive of Porton Down, Gary Aitkenhead, interviewed this week, apparently said that his staff couldn’t confirm the Russians were responsible.
And so, on the day that the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) met at Russia’s behest in The Hague, the headlines were all about Britain’s embarrassment. The social media wing of the Corbynistas were out in full “we wuz right all along” force. “Words matter, he lied,” said one Twitter meme, retweeted thousands of times. Scot Nat MPs retweeted a leading Scots commentator writing that the “stunning thing is not that Boris lied, but so many European governments backed Theresa May without seeing evidence”.
Asked by John Humphrys on the Today programme yesterday, “Does it surprise you that Porton Down now seems to be suggesting that maybe the poison didn’t come from Russia?” (we’ll come back to the question itself in a moment). The shadow home secretary Diane Abbott replied: “What surprised me was that so many people were willing to rush into the media and say that it was unequivocally Putin.”
Abroad, others were discussing the news. In Germany, a deputy chairman of the ruling Christian Democratic Union, Armin Laschet, asked on Twitter whether “if one forces nearly all Nato countries into solidarity, shouldn’t one have certain evidence?” This was the iceberg’s tip.
And this was before it was discovered that the Foreign Office (FO) had issued its own tweet on March 22 saying that scientists at Porton Down had “made clear that [the substance used in Salisbury] was a military-grade nerve agent produced in Russia”. The deletion of this tweet yesterday was quickly publicised by, among others, the Russian Embassy in London.
I am not a Johnson man but when you read the transcript of his interview you can see that he doesn’t quite do what people have accused him of. This was the question: “You argue that the source of this nerve agent, novichok, is Russia. How did you manage to find it out so quickly? Does Britain possess samples of it?” Answer: “Let me be clear with you . . . When I look at the evidence, I mean the people from Porton Down, the laboratory . . . ” Q: “So they have the samples . . . ?”A: “They do. And they were absolutely categorical and I asked the guy myself, I said, ‘Are you sure?’ And he said there’s no doubt.”
Now to Mr Aitkenhead, who told Sky News that the substance was definitely the military-grade nerve agent novichok, but that “we [Porton Down] have not identified the precise source, but we have provided the scientific info to the government who have then used a number of other sources, some of them intelligence-based”. He also said that novichok, a Russian-originated substance, required “extremely sophisticated methods to create something, only in the capabilities of a state actor”. He did NOT say, pace Mr Humphrys and others, “maybe the poison didn’t come from Russia”. I’d say it is pretty evident that Mr Aitkenhead thinks that Russia is precisely where it came from.
As to the FO tweet, it is claimed — credibly, I think — that this was a mistaken compression of a speech given by the British ambassador to Moscow, Laurie Bristow. So what we seem to have is a degree of clumsiness which has emerged, horribly timed, to coincide with the OPCW talks. By all means let’s knock the government for that. But what we don’t have is any real doubt among experts or policy-makers that the Salisbury substance originated in Russia and was deployed by a state actor, which is vanishingly unlikely to be any country other than Russia.
Keep your eye on that ball: that someone thought it was OK to try to assassinate a British resident on British soil using a nerve agent. It’s the only ball that counts. According to Professor Sergei Karaganov, also speaking on the BBC yesterday, that dark someone was more likely to be British or “British friends, wanting a crisis”. Perhaps he meant the EU; Russians don’t like the EU. This Professor Karaganov is not just anyone. He is almost the Henry Kissinger of modern Russia — a top academic, a valued adviser, a prolific writer and thinker. So hearing this absurd conspiracy nonsense from him was a bit like listening to, say, the estimable historian Sir Ian Kershaw arguing that 9/11 was an inside job. Karaganov couldn’t possibly have believed it, but he said it anyway.
For various reasons there are all too many people in the West who will be diverted or want to divert others on the matter of Russian culpability. There are pacifists who dread a nuclear war, anti-imperialists for whom the West is the world’s greatest enemy, business interests (like that German politician tweeter) who fear the effects of bad relations with Russia, and mistaken oppositionists who blame their own government for everything and trust it on nothing.
They all need to understand something. Russia is not playing their game. Russia’s policy is to pursue its own interests ruthlessly and to use the West’s self-doubts and self-criticism against it. When Russia commits an atrocity or makes a bloody mistake, it drags the issue out, delays an inquiry and peppers the atmosphere with conspiracist chaff. So the grass now grows long over the 298 occupants of the Malaysian airliner shot down by a Russian ground-to-air missile system deployed by pro-Russian separatists in the summer of 2014.
Professor Karaganov may endorse propagandistic nonsense but he is not stupid. In an essay last year entitled The Victory of Russia and the New Concert of Nations he wrote that back in 2014 he had re-read War and Peace “and I was struck by one phrase which I had somehow overlooked before: ‘A battle is won by those who are firmly resolved to win it.’ I understood that Russia was resolved and would win.”
Today, looking at how easily we in the West can be diverted from any resolution of our own, it’s depressingly hard to disagree.